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55 Comments on "Which Engine Will Power The Tejas?"

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

superb post, shiv. i think you have captured the issue rather well. but i have a feeling ADA will go for the 414.

nitish
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nitish
6 years 8 months ago

Ive never seen afterburners engaged in LCA(GE F-404 engines)in any of the pics available on net.is it bcos 404 is low powered or jus that hal doesnt wanna spare extra fuel for the show.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

"power upto 100 fighters (with an option to power 60 more)"…that's it? I would have imagined at least double that number of LCA's taking to the skies. Any scoop on the final number of Tejas' to be inducted and eventually/hopefully exported?

Prasun K Sengupta
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

General Electric's F414-GE-400 for the Tejas LCA Mk2 and General Electric's F110-132A for the F-16IN Super Viper. GE will sweep it all…game, set and match! GE also gets to set up an engine MRO workshop for CFM56 and GE90 turbofans at Nagpur, thereby overshooting–in dollar terms–the MoD-mandated industrial offsets requirements. Just prior to announcing the M-MRCA competition's winner, the MoD will announce that the the DPP is being 'modified' to recognise the strength and value of 'strategic' indirect aviation-related industrial offsets.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Shiv,
I am 21.Somewhere down the line,i'll be telling my kid about a plane named Tejas that's was our product but never came into action.Believe me i can make a fighter plane faster than ADA with hook or crook.Damn these guys…..all you hear is flight tests.Make me Defence Minister and i'll teach these people how to work.

Rasogulla Eater

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

shiv, this photo is by kedar karmarkar of BR. you can find this one in his blog. it's also there in the aero india threads at br forum.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

F414 is definitely a powerful engine but its add-ons include American sanctions and no support during time of likely conflict with PAK also one should take into consideration that the EJ200 will be comming with thrust vectoring also ej200 is better than RD33 refer to wiki which is what is required LCA is ligher than the JF17 and also with EJ200 it can stay ligher agile and will require less fuel also the range will improve thats what I feel but everything will be decided by ADA Air Force and Gov. All the best to them

anthony
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anthony
6 years 8 months ago

The Eurojet EJ200 (same engine that powers the Eurofighter Typhoon) would provide supercruise capability for the Tejas.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

The MCA must have an indigenous engine.

Vincent
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6 years 8 months ago

414 is the best. It can be serviced on a carrier thats moving up and down and that is suitable if the LCA is ever going to be navalized.

America rocks. India is the usher.

Kartik
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Kartik
6 years 8 months ago
how much ToT will GE allow for its F-414 considering how tight US export restrictions are ? and if in the future, the Tejas can be exported, a US engine will definitely be a no-no because any product that competes with the F-16 will not get US permission for export. the same problem came up when Boeing was to give consultancy for ADA on the flight test program. It was also seen on the South Korean F/A-50, where South Korea was not allowed by the US to put an AESA because of a clause in the contract that Lockheed Martin… Read more »
the terminator
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the terminator
6 years 8 months ago
Would ADA and GOI go for the GE414 knowing well the Americans have a penchant for sanctions and technology denial if India does not toe its foreign policies? What about the ever present end-user clauses in the bilateral sale and purchase agreements? It would be wiser and safer to go for the European aero engine. At least we won't be left in the lurch should a conflict or all out war take place with the Pakis who are more all weather friends of the US than India can ever be. Hope good sense will prevail. Hope MMS and the coterie… Read more »
KR
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KR
6 years 8 months ago

With the 414 rated at 98kN, this should not even be a debate. How come the EJ200 is even in with a chance?

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

"The selection process begins next
month. Stay tuned."

And when does it end?

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

So what happens to the Kaveri then?

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Jo Jen Gupta Ji,

You are so certain that the F-16IN will win the MRCA. Then what is the point of this competiton. I am sure you have excuses lined up if and when it will not win.

NJS
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

EJ200 is lesser than GE414 by 120 kg.
60 % TOT is announced for this project .
I don't think General electric will transfer 60 % TOT.
The single advantage GE has is 98 kn

India is almost selecting Defensive weapons , India Hardly needed offensive weapons . most of the offensive weapons are in problematic ( Howitzer guns , Fighter jets ( to stop depletion) , Long range Anti tank missile & MBRL , Submarines, Longer range bombers TU-22 M3 backfire. DAC should need to go Fastrack .

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Can we also use the GE 414 engine is Gripen-NG-MKI?

That would be best. GE doesn't care if it's engine is used in a Gripen-NG or an F-सोलाह.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago
Dear Folks , How come we are talking about an LCA Mark II when there is not even LCA Mark Zero . As an Indian I have to say with a very heavy heart that its time to end this never ending tamasha and go for an immediate interim replacement for Mig 21 – be it a Gripen or a Mig 35 or F16 ( considering the tomfoolry going on even a Spifire would be welcome )and leave the choice to the pilots and not some bloody " bureaucrat/technocrat/mediacrat/***crat"Make a choice and go the whole hog in implementing the choice.… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Yes Vincent – 414 is best coz its a yankee product.

All,

Even if the IAF was issuing an RFP for shoes..and in the fray were reebok and nike…Vincent woud say Nike is best and IAF should go for Nike….it is implict that this is becoz Nike is American and Reebok is not.

need I say more.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

@ SHIV, this photo has been wrongly attributed. It's Copyright is held by Kedar Karmarkar who is a well known aero photographer.

please edit your acknowledgment ASAP.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

"the EJ200 fits perfectly into the same hole."

Wow

Prasun K Sengupta
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

To Kartik & the terminator: Try to check out the number of US-origin components on the EJ200 turbofan from companies like BF Goodrich Aerospace. All these components will be subject to US laws and regulations governing exports of military hardware.

Vincent
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6 years 8 months ago
There is more to engine quality than just wet thrust. The Chinese know this, which is why they're still fooling around with their first 4th gen fighter engine. Reliability, operability, readiness, reaction, control, materials, cooling, pressure, stage temperatures, component life, part swapping, engine access, feedback monitoring, MTBO – all important. Welcome to the big leagues. Unlike Russian engines in your Mig-29s which had to be pulled out and thrown away like a condom after just as low as 100 hours, the F414 is designed to stay and perform for as long 2000 hours of flight. Excellent piece of engineering. I… Read more »
subhojit
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6 years 8 months ago
I have a few possibly naive queries. 1) Both the engines will require gearboxes. Are these integral with the engine – or is a separate gearbox being mated ? Will the position of the Gearbox in a EJ200 be same as a GE414? 2)The higher the bypass ratio – the more volume of air is needed. I understand that EJ200 is a higher bypass engine – will the existing inlets work? The practice of creating additional inlets may increase the RCS. 3)The EJ 200 can be set for higher thrust with a "life" penalty – The GE 414 EDE can… Read more »
Indian
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Indian
6 years 8 months ago

I guess there is a mistake in the article.

You said "While the EJ200 powers the Eurofighter Typhoon, the F404 powers Boeing's F/A-18E/F Super Hornet as well as the JAS-39 Gripen IN"

I think it's GE 414 Engine that will be used in F-18 and Gripen IN (for MMRCA) not F404. Isn't it ?

Correct me if I am wrong or update the article if you are 😉

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago
F414 is a little long in the tooth and has almost exhausted its growth potential. EJ200 on the other hand has a more modern thermodynamic cycle and ample growth potential. Its an engine much smaller to the current F404 powering LCA and can accomodate a larger Low pressure fan to increase thrust to over 100KN. Such a modification has long been planned but was never required by EF customers. Even in its current form EJ200 has a higher dry thrust to F414 and requires less air flow. Air intakes of LCA will have to be redesigned to accomodate the greater… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

TO Shiv and Prasun

EJ200 vs F414

most of the time fighter doesn't use afterburner main thing is the dry thrust

so when looking at dry thrust there is only 2kN dry thrust difference between F414 and EJ2000 while EJ2000 being 120kg less in weight.

DIAMETER

EJ2000——- 29 inches
F404——— 35 INCHES
F414——— 35 inches

clearly shows EJ2000 can be fitted with structural modifications.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

While lowering the number of inventory types is laudable, having engines from same manufacturer ( especially if it is USA) for both MRCA and LCA will mean that in the event of sanctions, a large part of the IAF fleet will be grounded!! Something I hope the IAF keeps in mind

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

F414 it is and not F404.

Also, they are testing two brand new engines for the F-18 – to replace the current engine. So, growth potential (if that is a concern) should be pretty good.

However, IF the F-16IN is selected then alll this is moot.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Unlike Russian engines in your Mig-29s which had to be pulled out and thrown away like a condom after just as low as 100 hours

So Vincent Unkil, now we know why you are so jealous of Russians. The hardcore Russian men 'use' a condom straight for 100 hours while your kind would be lucky to go 100 seconds. Everything becomes clear.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

clearly shows EJ2000 can be fitted with structural modifications.

EJ2000 is definitely the more compact engine and will make an easy fit into Tejas. But what about MRCA then? Both Rafale and Eurofighter are frightfully expensive to buy and maintain, we will have to work with Saab and certify the Gripen NG MKI with the EJ2000 which will add at least 8 months.

Vincent
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

Use your brains. If American arms don't work and are not the best how come they consist of 60% of global foreign arms sales?

US leads the way in foreign arms sales
http://www.reuters.com/article/ousivMolt/idUSN1744179620090617

Saudi Arabia buying 72 more F-15s
http://www.dodbuzz.com/2009/09/08/saudis-eye-buying-72-f-15s/

Iraq aims to buy at least 96 F-16s
http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSTRE53035J20090401

Turkey to buy 7.8 billion Pac-3 missiles

http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed1/idUSTRE58A4KW20090911

Btw no one has problems with EUMA like sorry India. And nobody else has problems like this.

http://www.epapertoday.com/story.php?title=250-kg_bomb_falls_off_IAF_plane_no_one_hurt

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

In fact it makes sense NOT to have engine same as MRCA. At least LCA mk2 and MRCA will not both be grounded at the same time due to sanctions!!

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

vincent, don't talk about brains.

you don't have any.
BTW there's a rumor that your original brain was in your arse ?

is it true ? is it also true that you lost it when you took a dump at the age of 15 and flushed it away ?

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Vincent,
Its EULA, not EUMA. Anyways no one has problem because unlike them INDIA wants to use the weapons for fighting a war incase its pushed on to us.
Would you think US would allow spares to be sent to India if India had to blast one more Nuclear bomb for testing??
Its not only IAF that has problems with falling bombs, but even US AF has problems with it, just google for the same.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

9:47 PM

The solution to that is to stock up the spares. Buy lots of spares and consumables before you order the engines, and stock them at different locations in the country. Thus we can survive any sanction for long time.

I don't understand why our babus/netas don't order a lifetime worth of spares with engines. Always looking to maximize bribe potential…..lowlifes.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Vincent,

When you were born, humanity reached new low.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

to vincent

whole NATO,s.korea,australia,saudi arabia,UAE,israel are american stooge

so its clear that these countries will buy either US or european military equipment

so no need to shout

Vincent
Guest
6 years 8 months ago
Wait 1 second. You want to cooperate with the world on crucial technology like weapons and arms control, but you don't want to play by the rules? You want to have a credible civilian nuke industry yet you want to test nukes whenever you want? What the hell. Just because you are able to wag your head like a thambi or have an all year round tan doesn't make you special, or the fact that you can buy a few planes doesn't make you sacrosanct from technology leaking rules. If the USA didn't make countries play by the rules, India… Read more »
Vincent
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

Even the Pakis are more appreciate of American military tech superiority than stick-in-the-mud Bhindians. Just skim down the list in the link below at the accelerating military gap between Bharat and the Home of the Brave. Sidewinders fired from subs underwater. New affordable x-band Aegis-lite SPY-5. Also vast list of incremental improvmeents, but not incremental in the way like the 1 millionth and 556,223 test flight of Tejas with pylons, slightly bigger pylons, red coloured pylons, amusing shaped pylons, animal patterned pylons, etc.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/military-forum/

Stop dicking around, India.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

I hope the Kaveri engine becomes a success and eventually repace the foreign engines.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

I think the time has come to think about MCA now.nly we can get product on time.. otherwise same old outdated planes will be available. India should get the technology for the latest & best engine and try developing its own MCA for future now.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Complete LCA Tejas Update???

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

"Vincent said…

Even the Pakis are more appreciate of American military tech superiority than stick-in-the-mud Bhindians."

Shiv, how long are you going to allow this racist mofo to comment here in the name of free speech ?

there should be a limit to everything. this is shameful !

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

@Vincent,
What "rules" are you talking about? Those "rules" that allow you to produce nuke energy and test bums but the moment somebody else does it becomes a taboo !!!

And why do you care about our appreciation? Would you start loving your neighbour's son because he won a race while yours is taking baby steps at walking ???

Vincent
Guest
6 years 8 months ago
No one is testing nukes anymore for good reason. And if you do, they won't play nice. First mover advantage. You should have thought about that before practicing socialism in past decades. Cry to the UN, they will make you a superpower. Hey wait… I like India. I really do. But you lot have screwed up the country for decades, I must speak out. Hindu rate of growth anyone? You are one of the few democratic countries who chose to embrace the Soviet Union and its idiocies and now you want to complain that other people have moved far ahead… Read more »
NJS
Guest
6 years 8 months ago

To Vincent,
As long as pakis taste american $$$ in name fake Anti-terrorist operation, they use to appreciate of American military tech , No one in india hate American's , if u ask any normal person in india , which country they like most , at least 70 % of people will say its USA then only to other countries , but at the same time we hate US on supporting to PAkistan in supplying weapons, which could be used against india in war.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 8 months ago

Vincent,

You wrote:

"Just skim down the list in the link below at the accelerating military gap between Bharat and the Home of the Brave…"

er…minor correction…it should be"
"Just skim down the list in the link below at the accelerating military gap between Bharat and the Home of the Cowards…"

At least get ur facts right.

anthony
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anthony
6 years 8 months ago

The EJ200 turbofan will be the proposed Tejas powerplant. Why? Supercruise capability.

HAL should negotiate with EADS for licenced production of the EJ200 turbofan, should it?

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