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26 Comments on "Scrappy Indian Navy Copter Bid Nears End"

Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

NH90 had some problem which were reported by German,French & Australian defence. Also S70 will come with certain restrictions and minus certain key technologies.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

Last para repeated twice.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

Is there no russian or french helicopter in same category?

I remember the sanctions that were put on Seaking helipcopters at the time of Shakti tests in 1998, creating serious problems for the IN. Brits had said they are not putting any sanctions but some parts of Seakings were from US hence the sanctions.

DJ
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DJ
3 years 10 months ago

S70b is older technology cf MH-60R. NH 90 has so many delays in proction that many partner countries have reduced their purchase. For instance, Norway is waiting for them for 9 years!! Also Aystealia has grounded their NH 90 and Australian Navy opted for MH 60R recently. I think navy has screwed up in this tender by short listing two bad contenders.

Indian
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Indian
3 years 10 months ago
To Anon at 12:25PM You are correct..IN had this issue of suffering due to US sanctions.. post Pokhran 2 atom bomb test. Now IN is trying to put all it's eggs in one bucket…and if in the future tests any ICBM ..? US Sanctions will hurt them (or rather us Indians badly)also these helos will not have critical technologies/instruments as India has not signed 1.CISMOA 2.End User Verification Agreement 3.NPT 4.MTCR etc. agreements yet..? also S-70/MH-60R, all these helos are quite large compared to Seakings/Kamovs now IN has or planned Naval ALH..hence IN pilots will have quite difficulty to land… Read more »
pankaj
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pankaj
3 years 10 months ago

avoid made in usa product us is not trousted supplyer and india not finilized any deal just see tanker,attack heli,mrmr,light tank,javlin,smart bomb indian military military wish list long but politishion did not give any chance for curroption they want to clean there shirt military get weapons who purshes it 8-10 year ago

Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

Dear Shiv

The second phase of NMRH is not for 44 but 75/76 helicopters..This was mentioned by Lockhed Martin CEO. It appeared in media… LM said it is going to offer S60M Romeo for which it thinks the largest tender in world for NMRH…Shiv correct me if I am wrong

Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago
The 70B & 60R came from the SH-60 series of aircraft (hundreds of aircraft) and those aircraft can trace their roots back to the Blachawk since all were derived from that aircraft. So, you could say these two aircraft represent the experience Sikorsky has gained from building thousands of aircraft. The point is that both aircraft meet the Indian navy's NSQRs. To me, the big issue are all the problems the NH-90 has had and continues to have. NHI has no where's near the experience that Sikorsky has in ASW & ASuW warfare and building maritime warfare rotary wing platforms.… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago
Both the S-70B and NH-90 are two of the worst choices for Indian Navy. NH-90 has a troubled development past (although most of the teething troubles are now over). S-70B is a generation older, and will place the IN chopper fleet at the mercy of whims and fancy of volatile US senate (Seaking Redux). It seems that the deal is already fixed in favour of Skrosky, same as IAF childish choice of Apache attack choppers. This will be a part of the "payment" agreed to by Manmohan Govt. for the nuke deal along with C-17, P-8 and C-130. A sensible… Read more »
Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago

I keep hearing about export issues. The S-70B is in service with 5 international navies in a variety of configurations. I seriously doubt that India will have any issues with export approval for any of the ASW or ASuW systems on that aircraft. All vendors should have already obtained export approval as part of the tender process.
2nd tender is for 75 aircraft.

the terminator
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the terminator
3 years 10 months ago
I am no expert in either of the helicopters in the fray to secure the IN deal. Notwithstanding the above I am somewhat astonished at the claims and counter claims of both the competitors. Whether both the contenders agree with the IN or not, the MOD should only award the contract to a contender chosen by the IN solely on their requirements. Lately India has been purchasing billion dollars worth of American made defense products. Though I am not anti-American, I have serious doubts as to the technologies offered in these deals. Most of the planes (C-130,C-17,P8,etc.) do not come… Read more »
Indian
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Indian
3 years 10 months ago
Few Observations.. 1.At the first place US will never offer MH-60R (an aggressive platform along with high tech sensors fitted on the fwd nose in the MH-60R)to India. 2.NH-90 is a maintenance proof Platform as it's airframes are made with Corrosion less CC composites (Doesn't get corroded due to impact of sea water and weather)where as SH-70 airframe is made up of conventional metal alloys.Hence a VERY VERY Important feature, IN should have put in Naval GSQR (may be taken off ..on purpose to give this order to US). 3.NH-90 is A TRUE MULTI ROLE PLATFORM ..due to REAR RAMP… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

In the desperation to avoid putting all its egg in one (Russian) basket, Indian military is surely putting all its egg in another (American) basket. For all their shortcomings, the Russians at least don't indulge in tech denial at crucial times. When the gloves are off, US sanction (accompanied by humiliating condescending admonitions by Hillary Clinton) will cripple a majority part of our transport and helicopter fleet.

Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago
There is so much emotion and distrust in some of these posts that the facts need to be revisited.1. Both the 70B & NH-90 have met all the requirements from the Indian navy. So the issue of not providing the latest technology is a non issue.2. No vendor I have known in my 35 years as a system integrator has ever embedded "bugs" in it's products. That just sounds like paranoia.3. No aircraft is fully resistant to corrosion from a maritime environment. While the NFH-90 does make use of composite materials and the 70B does not, that does not mean… Read more »
Sachin
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Sachin
3 years 10 months ago

The NH 90 and MH 60R were contenders for the Australian Navy's S 70B REPLACEMENT program (which the MH 60R eventually won). Makes one wonder whether NHIndustries objections of relaxations / preferential waivers to Sikorsky were really unfounded. If there have been changes / upgrades to the offered model, maybe it would have had a change in model number / Mark. I don't know. Just thinking out loud. But given the machinations in the corridors of power, you can never be sure. Just hope that the service gets the best possible tools to do its job.

Sachin
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Sachin
3 years 10 months ago

To Rik Lammers
With all due respect, you seem to be a highly knowledgeable and experienced professional in the rotary wing aviation industry. But by your own admission, you are a PAID EMPLOYEE of Sikorsky. So your (shameless?) plugging for the S70B HAS to be ignored. Nothing personal. I don't know much about either platform. But that's how it is.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago
As a concerned citizen of Bharat, I want any future PM of India to have the freedom of test new thermonuclear designs or even few old warheads in inventory to see how they are doing after being stocked for decade or two. This freedom gets at stake everytime we buy a military platform from US. Rik it does not need to be substantiated anymore than our past experience of Sea King Helicopters, LCA Tejas scietists dragged out of US labs and all their equipment even the ones they took from India confiscated. Leading to delay in LCA Tejas program. So… Read more »
Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago
Sachin & Others, I am retired from Sikorsky. My "shameless plugging" is not based on any favoritism but my 35 years in designing avionics systems. You do not know me so I understand how you might think as you do. That does not change any of the data I have presented. Not familiar with the Sea King or nuclear issues but everything I have said about the 70B is true and the proposed aircraft has met the NSQRs and the configuration presented received export approval. So, no sanctions or export restrictions I am aware of. The NH-90 problems are well… Read more »
Raja Raja Chola
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Raja Raja Chola
3 years 10 months ago
From open source literature available on the internet it can be said that the NH90 engine performance in tropical climates is a bit suspect. The eurocopter tigers in service with the australian army have been plagued with engine troubles ever since they were inducted. also with regards to the seahawk its a well developed and mature platform compared to the NH90. The seahawk is the right choice for the Indian Navy. as regards to possibility of us sanctions against india in the future. well thats a leap of faith the Govt of India has to take, afterall having taken the… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
3 years 10 months ago

NH 90 has a lot of problems! I dont know if S70B is modern enough but is a proven platform.

Indian
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Indian
3 years 10 months ago

To Those…who are just doing propaganda against NH-90…
Have a question..

Waht these negative comments means : That all of the following WESTERN TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED countries, who has selected NH-90 for their Armed Forces/Navy like Germany, Finland, France, Italy, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Sweden, Oman, Spain, Greece, Belgium, Portugal and Australia. ARE FOOLS !!! IS THAT SO ?

And we Indians are smarter than these countries,that we are selecting scaled down version of MH-60R /S-70 from US is an intelligent choice ???

Need to give a better though to digest..I feel.

=================
I don't hate any one..but I love my country India.

Raja Raja Chola
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Raja Raja Chola
3 years 10 months ago
Mr Indian i would like to rebut your comments regarding the so called propaganda against NH90. The countries you have mentioned that have selected the NH90 have their own specific criteria which in their opinion was best met by the NH90. This in no ways means that they are intellectually superior to the professional choices made by the Indian Navy as to which helicopter best meets the diverse and extremely demanding operating conditions for India.Also the Seahawk was the model requested by the Indian Navy instead of the MH60Romeo for the current RFP of 16 choppers. The Indian Navy requirements… Read more »
Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago
Indian, Look on the web dude! Look at all the problems the basic NH-90 has and continues to have. Australia is co-producing the NH-90 in Australia and opted for the 60R. Norway went with Blackhawks. And let's not forget the maritime version (NFH-90) is a completely different bird with an extensive mission system that has yet to be proven. Despite the so called "global economy", European countiries continue to be tremendous pressure to buy European. Unless NHI get its act together soon, they will lose more orders. If the S-70B wins India watch out for the 70B dominating international sales… Read more »
Rik Lammers
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Rik Lammers
3 years 10 months ago
Thank-you Raja Raja, that was well said. Lockheed Martin is developing a commercial/exportable version of the 60R that I believe will be offered in the next tender for 75 aircraft. The 70B will also be offered again as well. The thing to remember is that Lockheed has yet to deliver a 60R to the international market place and the 60R introduction to the USN fleet was anything but smooth. As you can tell I do not have a very high opinion of them as an integrator. The S-70B has been delivered internationally for over 15 years in a variety of… Read more »
Rikbo
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Rikbo
3 years 10 months ago

Guess "shortly" is a relative term. Wonder what is delaying this announcement.

Tenders
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3 years 7 months ago

Indian Tenders: Get detailed information on all Indian tenders at tendernews.com, this is best tender information provider. Access for all type of online tenders from India including government tenders, corporate tenders, public tenders.

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