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14 Comments

  1. 1

    Anonymous

    FINALLY !

    THERE IS GOD !

    Reply
  2. 2

    Abhiman

    Mr. Aroor, though very unlikely, it remains to be seen if HAL has been sent an RFP for Tejas or not. If yes, then I may agree with Anonymous (if I may allow myself some humour in this hour).

    Thank you.

    Reply
  3. 3

    sniperz11

    Hold on to your horses…

    the RFP was ready a month ago (or more). Now, they have cleared the RFP for relese. Releasing it will take a couple of months more. It may be delayed further even there. Our bureaucracy does always find innovative ways to delay stuff.

    Reply
  4. 4

    Abhiman

    The newspaper “The Hindu”, which apparently favours foreign MRCAs, has also acknowledged that one of the reasons for calling of this tender is the delay in the development of the Tejas.

    The following is an excerpt from one of its articles today :-

    India plans to buy the fighters to arrest the depletion in force levels due to retirement of the older generation of planes, ….. and the delay in the development of the indigenous fighter Tejas.”

    Since the Tejas is on schedule now, it can atleast be sent an RFP if the RFP proposal cannot be cancelled altogether.

    The Hindu further describes the possible win by SAAB and EU consortium as “a dream come true”. This when the Eurofighter project is yet to complete and when there is no confirmation of the RFP’s definite future release to the EU consortium. Bias of the newspaper apart, most news reports today do mention that there are 6 likely contenders. It may mean that all the 6 often mentioned contenders may not be sent the RFP at all. Thus, EU consortium may be unlikely to recieve the RFP at all.

    At least one magazine, The Week had in an article more than a year ago stated that the Tejas would have been a contender had it been on schedule. By this reason also, the Tejas may be sent an RFP.

    Thanks.

    Reply
  5. 5

    alka

    Hi Shiv
    How can you stop yourself about this “mother of all deals” since its yours fav. topic and you did a superb story on jet deal in Headlines today. we would like to know yr veiws on this. come on…do a favour to the def correspondent community.
    Mukesh Kaushik
    UNI-Varta

    Reply
  6. 6

    alka

    Hi Shiv
    How can you stop yourself about this “mother of all deals” since its yours fav. topic and you did a superb story on jet deal in Headlines today. we would like to know yr veiws on this. come on…do a favour to the def correspondent community.
    Mukesh Kaushik
    UNI-Varta

    Reply
  7. 7

    Abhiman

    Mr. Aroor, a relevant and “thought-provoking” statement by a member named IDev from Bharat-rakshak forum is reproduced below :-

    “how much sense does it make for India to ask for TOT and begin induction into its force of what will be clearly inferior technology i.e. F-16, F-18 when the rest of the world including Singapore and Israel will begin inducting the JSF at about the same time that India will begin inducting the MRCA. This whole MRCA process seems to be about institutionalizing second rate aircraft into the IAF.What is the point of this looooong drawn out MRCA process if the end result is induction of second grade technology into the IAF. Or….is the only consideration the induction of first grade money into first rate Swiss banks for certain politicos/bureaucrats the only rationale for this whole process? “

    I agree with this view because the Flight International report referenced by him mentions that Singapore, Israel and Japan shall be offered the JSF next year. Not that these nations pose a military threat to India, but that a large country like India whose Air-Force has stated a “force-projection” strategy, can easily be outmatched by Singapore in technology if not numbers, starting next year itself. This, when even the first metal of the destined—but already oldening—MRCA would still not be cut for another 5 years from now.

    The former IAF chief Mr. Tyagi had stated hat all the MRCAs would have finished induction in 20 years time from their selection. So by 2032, when Singapore, Saudi Arabia, and Australia would be flying multiple squadrons of F-35 and possibly F-22, India would still be inducting the last of the F-16s, F-18s or MiG-35.
    USAF would have an operation squadron of UCAVs by then.

    I think that the “jury is still out” on whether this deal is still necessary or not.

    Thank you.

    References :
    Flight International, “USA to approve export variant of F-35“, 28-06-2007

    http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?p=368037#368037

    Reply
  8. 8

    Anonymous

    Why would the RFP be delayed for the development of tejas as tejas and HAL are not even in the reckoning…..as they’re contenders for the deal to be considered for the delay…..its always those six foreign players which are being talked about.

    Reply
  9. 9

    Abhiman

    Anonymous, I’m afraid I don’t understand your reasoning. My view is that HAL’s Tejas should be in the reckoning. Why-do-you-discuss-Tejas-when-IAF-is-not-considering is not an answer to my view.

    If you consider the “talking about” in media reports, I may repeat that all media articles yesterday mentioned that one of the reasons for the proposal of the MRCA deal was the delay in the Tejas (Hindu’s repeat article today omitted this point, unlike its previous one yesterday). Atleast a couple of major cover stories in the media did mention the possibility of Tejas’ candidature had it not been delayed.

    Now that the “tables have turned”, viz. the Tejas has accelerated in development and will be inducted far earlier than the MRCA, it would atleast be expected that the Indian Gripen be sent an RFP atleast, if the proposal is not rolled back. Infact, applying the same reasoning in reverse, the Tejas should be fast-tracked and be the MRCA because “there has been a delay in selection process of the MRCA”.

    Thanks.

    Reply
  10. 10

    Teews

    Abhiman,

    if your read this article and if it is correct

    http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=2872990&C=airwar

    then according to this statement F-16 and Grippen will not make the cut but neither will Tejas.

    “The jet should be powered by twin turbofans that provide thrust of between 25,000 and 30,000 pounds, yielding a top speed of Mach 2 and a range of more than 2,500 kilometers, an Indian Air Force official said.”

    You can argue that this article is written by Vivek Raghuvanshi and as such does not warrent credibility, but if IAF requirements state that then LCA won’t make it.

    Only way is to wait for an official announcement and RFP.

    Reply
  11. 11

    Abhiman

    teews, the statement of the IAF official may be his personal view, otherwise F-16, Gripen (and possibly Tejas) would not have been sent an RFP. These single-engined planes were the original contenders, of course after the Mirage-2000 (again single) became unavailable.

    IAF already operates the Su-30 MKI and MiG-29, and thus another twin- twin-engined fighter would be very cost-prohibitive. Since we “ritually” compare ourselves with China in most respects like economy, it may be mentioned that the PLAAF also operates only one twin-engined fighter i.e. Su-30 MKK (the JH-7A bomber is a failure after only 20 units were ever built). No further units of the Su-30 MKK have been inducted after 2004.

    The current priority of the PLAFF is the J-10, and to an extent the JF-17—both of which are single-engined. This when China has thrice India’s land-area, and has military thrust towards Taiwan, Japan, US and India.

    In the same way, it is highly unlikely that the IAF shall choose yet another twin-engined plane as the MRCA. The MRCA shall be single-engined, and in that the Tejas shall be the most cost-effective choice.

    Vivek Raghuvanshi does not appear to write for the ToI any longer, which may be indicative of the lesser credibility of his articles, though ToI itself is a highly biased and often exaggerative paper.

    Thank you.

    Reply
  12. 12

    Anonymous

    abhiman you have SERIOUSLY BEGUN TO GET ON EVERYBODY”S NERVES NOW! stop this bullshit steamrolling nonsense on your effing LCA for MRCA shit. you are putting everyone to sleep, and nobody even reads your silly lengthy referenced comments anymore. when i see your bloody footnotes, i feel like pulling out a pump-action shotgun and taking it to your face. an earnest request, my man. please obsess with something else now. we have really had it up to here with your LCA nonsense.

    Reply
  13. 13

    sniperz11

    Speak for yourself anon. Dont try to include everyone in your opinion please.

    Reply
  14. 14

    Abhiman

    Anonymous, I may politely ask you which Air-Force operates 3 types of twin-engined fighters ?* When even the thrice as large China is interested only in single-engine planes after abandoning Su-30 MKK, India can also surely induct single-engine planes as MRCA—–not because Chinese are also doing it, but because if they don’t induct, we on account of being their military adversary, do not have to either.

    The IAF is unlikely to have more than 2 types of twin-engined fighters in service at any point of time, because of their higher operation costs. The IAF’s new doctrine of “Force Projection” also does not require twin-engined fighters; USAF F-16s were used in the Iraq war effectively and as many F-18s were not needed. Besides, DRDO will develop the twin-engined MCA, which shall serve the IAF for many decades.

    *Note : Russia still operates its Soviet-era older MiG-25 and derivatives till now in addition to Su-30 and MiG-29. But MiG-25 is in the process of being decommissioned. Moreover, it has 8 times the land-area of India.

    Reply

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