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  1. 1


    Great article. You have hit the nail on the head.

  2. 2


    A well written article with absolute clarity of thought. But is anybody, ANYBODY! listening?
    Jai hind and God save us!

  3. 3


    Dear Mr.Shiv
    An excellent piece in your blog. Well brought out. It is indeed the worst year for serving and retired armed force personnel. No other democratic country would have done these kind of injustice to its armed forces. Hope those political leaders both ruling and opposition pretend to be deaf, will wake up and do the damage control soon.Better late than never. Please try to give coverage to this through your channel Headlines Today.

  4. 4


    Dear Mr.Shiv
    An excellent piece in your blog. Well brought out. It is indeed the worst year for serving and retired armed force personnel. No other country would have done these kind of injustice to its armed forces. Hope those political leaders both ruling and opposition pretend to be deaf, will wake up and do the damage control soon.Better late than never. Please try to give coverage to this through your channel Headlines Today.

  5. 5


    Hell with this nation.
    the way armed forces are being illtreated pakistan india ka BAND BAJAA DEGA.

  6. 6


    What A Great Harm The IAS Lobby and Madame"s Govt has deliberately and consiousely heaped on the Armed Forces of the Country vide 6 CPC. Look at this:

    1. The greatest damage is pushing the Armed Forces into political sapce where it never was. Now every one is talking of Votting, election, support from Political parties and opposition. Cheifs protesting against bureacratic injusice and arrogance and rushing to Political leadership. Political leadership not bothered and bureaucrtes enjoying the fun. The only thing left now is pushing Armed Forces into things which have not happened so far, that is 1857.

    2. LT COL Purohit's alleged and apparaently made up involvement in Malegaon has not only tremendiously helped Pakistani Cause and propaganda, but also pinted Army as containing Saffaron elements to the Muslim population of the country and the world. unthinkable and unimaginable. Even British and US media is quotting Malegaon and Samjhouta Express to chesticise India. This consiracy was a joint venture of IAS, IPS and Congress politicians.

    3. Lowering the status and slaries of Armed Forces Officers and personell and pushing those even below the CPOs. An officer in CPO is commanding officer in PB-4 grade in 16 years (can be lowered further) but Armed Forces are given this status to selected Cols after 20 years. The Director of Civil Services was never equivallent to Col buy CPO Commandant and Director brought at par with Cols.

    4. A CPO DIG was in between Lt Col and Col pay scale but he has been deliberately brought at par with Brig of the Army. DIG is 14 years of Service and Brig at 30 years of Armed Forces Service. Look at this inequality and injustice. KM Chandrasekhar in one article talked of balance. This is his sense of balance and equillibrium. The Countries Cab Secy have these standards when it comes to AF. One need not guess who is the origin of all eveils afflicting AF.

    5. Lt Col rank always was equivallant to director and JAG / NFSG. All equivallant ranks in pre revised pay sclaes s-24 and s-25 were brought to PB-4 but LT Col was singled out out of hundreds of such positions to be pushed down to PB-3. That is the sense of balance of India to bureacrate which he has temerity to justify.

    6. The status of each rank of the AF were pushed down bu one clearly proving deliberation and sinister intent of the Committee of Secretaries and IAS dominated 6CPC singling out AF.

    7. The Armed Forces attitude towards the environment has completely changed over months. From a carefree, not bothered, trusting and loving youngster who would mature not before he is a Colonel, he has suddenly becoming calculating, suspicious, aware. arguing, tying to find out what is waht and who is who. He is suddenly been rendered insecure and worried, status conscious and competetive, thus chenalising his enrgies in areas where AF would never want him to tread.

    8. AF officers have made pushed into looking at interanl affirs where he was alway professionally involved but never ideologically. For him his profession task were supreme and he never bothered about talking to a Thanedaar or SP at equal footing to accompished his tasked. But now he will deamnd status and eqivalance and the functional necessities will suffer. In joint operations aginst terrorist in J&k one nevr bothered whether police party was headed by a Constable or SP, not any more I suppose. Look at the harm to the functinalty and jointness.

    9. The virus of Status and Turfs have been allowed to be injected into the system so badly that Professinal and Functional consideration has been given a goby for the sake of ego and turfs. Look at this farce which was inacted in Mumbay. ADGP who does not know head or tail of Army heads the professional Army contingent of NSG. Police and IAS have badly enecroached upon Army Professinal areas but only for Command. Nothing can be much more damaging to the image and morale of an Army unit being commanded by an unprofessional IPS shod.

    10 The way things have been handled so far, the Political leadership clearly have failled to handle the issue. On the Contrary wrong signals have been conveyed, media has been manipulated, stories inserted and hit pieces made to be published. Sonia and Rahul did not meet veterans. Mukherjee Antony and Chidambaram have exhibitted that they do not and can not nake their own judgements but to follow Shushma Nath and KM Chandrasekhar. The PM has now pushed the file to the bureaucrate who is responsible for the greatest harm that has been brought on the security of this country.

    Yes, I do agree that so much of harm has never been brought to the Armed Forces and the Country so far in history as in 2008 through verious deliberate acts. Look who is being made hero for Bombay as if people do noy know it. Good sense and magnimity of Indian mass is being taken advanatge of. Even in time of such national emmergencies, our bureacracy thinks of lime light, hogging media attention and playing as bosses. Shame on such cratures.

    This drama is being played for last so many months. Pakistan has taken advantage of this situation and shown IAS and IPS their places. Well, if the limp and alien political leadership delibertely fails to show the IAS and IPS their places, the Pakistani Generls would decide our
    Politicians places. Next time onwards perhaps, Manmohan might have to talk to Kayani for continuation of his term. That is bound to happen when you deliberately break your Arms. The deployment and operations of AF will be dictated by Kayani.

    Watch and see it. That is the state Italian Madame and her IAS / IPS have brought the Country to.

    Jai Hind…. but whoes Hind is it anyway ??????

  7. 7


    I doubt whether any officer or jawan worth his salt would now serve in the armed forces. Thanks to this Govt’s manipulations. This country does not deserve its armed forces. Thank You, India for telling us that we are unwanted. 2009 is not going to bring in hopes but realisation about the damage that this whole issue has done.

  8. 8


    Dear Shiv

    The Pakistani Army has acquired such a stature that not only they decide the status and fate of their civilian politicians but also have acquired capabilities to decide on the fate of Indian Politicians. Leave aside these nasty IAS and IPS whom they hold in great contempt as parasites.

    It appears Sonia has concluded anunderhand deal with Kayani and Paki Military establishement for winning next elections. That is why Malgaon, Mumbay and humiliation of Indian Armed Forces is utmost priority.

    Police has alredy started commanding army troops. Which country are we in and what a state of affairs.

    God save the Country as its Political leaderships takes shelter under the Sari of Expenditure secretary.

    God only save us……

  9. 9

    Col VT Venkatesh(retd)

    Hi Shiv
    Thanks for the coverage

  10. 10


    Indeed, these core demands were just the beginning of what was wrong. The 6th CPC has made tin-pot major generals out of IPS officers by giving them IGP rank at 16 years of service. In truth they are by service equivalent, somewhere between Lt. Cols and Cols. Even if the core demands are met, there is lots and lots more left to be fixed.

  11. 11


    The problem with this blog is that everyone who supports the armed forces in the pay scale controversy is extremely emotional and does not understand the reasons or logic behind the pay scale changes. Please visit Major Navdeep’s blog here and you will find out why the changes have been made here:

    Let me paste the logic here:

    As all of us know, the 6th CPC had made Grade Pay the bench mark of inter-se equivalence and seniority between different services and cadres.

    But after the Cabinet decision, it was clearly stated in the resolution that Grade Pay shall only determine seniority within a cadre. The 6th CPC recommendation was hence modified by the Cabinet.

    Ever wondered why this happened ??

    This simply happened to maintain the existing parities and equations within various organisations and also to maintain the superiority of certain services over the others.

    Let me elaborate. Let us take the example of the district administration. In a district, the District Magistrate (also known as Deputy Commissioner / Collector) is the head of the civil administration and the Superintendent of Police (also known as Senior Superintendent of Police in certain states) functions under the District Magistrate. The Police is just one of the various departments under the DM. The DM can be an officer of the Senior Time Scale (STS), Junior Administrative Grade (JAG) or in rare cases of the Selection Grade (SG), the same goes for the district Police Chief. Now it many-a-times happens that the district Police Chief is of a senior grade (and higher Grade Pay) than the DM and in such a case the DM would have been automatically declared lower in status in case of acceptance of GP equivalence between cadres. Hence purely to maintain such superiority, the system was changed by the Cabinet. Similarly at a more senior level, the Home Secretary, who is usually an officer of the Senior Administrative Grade (SAG) in a State may have to exercise supervisory functions over the DGP (Apex Grade or HAG +) and acceptance of the Pay Commission recommendation would have meant dilution of the State Home Secretaries over IPS officers actually their superiors. The same applies elsewhere too. College Lecturers would become senior to Directors of Education or Public Instruction (DPI) which the administrators would never want, Doctors would become senior to administrators of the Health department etc. To give you a live example, In Chandigarh, the Chief Engineer of the Chandigarh Housing Board is considered junior to an IAS officer of the JTS (GP Rs 5400) posted as the Joint CEO of the same board. This was the actual reason why the original recommendation was tweaked and tinkered into something else.

    But the practical situation is otherwise. Notwithstanding the stipulation of Grade Pay determining seniority only within a cadre, it becomes the de facto determinant of status, seniority and standing in practice. In cases of deputation to specific posts, it is the GP of officers of different services which is usually taken into account. In case of entitlements, again GP matters irrespective of service. I think it is high time this seniority system is set aside altogether except for Constitutional posts. The way ahead may be to give a fillip to specialists and slowly phase out the generalists. And this applies not just to the IAS but elsewhere too.

  12. 12


    This is a continuously evolving process. The 7th CPC may seek to bridge the gaps and address the disparities of rank that the armed forces disapprove of…it will take time, but until then, people should desist from statements that 1857 is around the corner etc…that does not help and will only serve to inflame sentiments. No one wants to screw over the armed forces-the whole process is an ongoing process and will take time to be perfected, just like any government process overhaul.

    So people, please be patient.

  13. 13



    What went wrong: The inside story

    Shishir Gupta
    Posted: Dec 26, 2008 at 1121 hrs IST

    The Intelligence failure in the run-up to the November 26 attacks and the crossed wires during the 60-hour siege: Shishir Gupta reconstructs
    A day after P Chidambaram took over as the Union Home Minister, National Security Advisor M K Narayanan, Home Secretary Madhukar Gupta, Intelligence Bureau Director P C Haldar and Maharashtra Director General of Police A K Roy met in his chamber to discuss the Mumbai terror attacks. Roy is said to have told them that the public was “extremely angry” and that India should militarily retaliate against Pakistan in order to teach them a lesson.

    Later that evening, the top bureaucrats, without the minister, assembled again in Gupta's room. With the NSA listening, Roy asked Haldar why the November 20 intelligence alert on a Lashkar-e-Toiba ship, given to the Coast Guard and Naval Headquarters, was not passed on to the Mumbai Police. [b]Haldar bluntly replied that the Mumbai Police could do nothing on the high seas, clearly indicating that the Navy and the Coast Guard had failed to deliver. [/b]

    The alerts sent by the IB in the past three years to the Mumbai Police and the action taken were again discussed threadbare at a meeting in Nagpur on December 19 between Roy, newly sworn in Maharashtra Chief Minister Ashok Chavan and State Home Minister Jayant Patil. There was concurrence on the need to have a high-level inquiry, which could be headed by R D Pradhan, who was home secretary under former prime minister Rajiv Gandhi, with V Balachandran, former special secretary of the Research and Analysis Wing, and Ajit Nimbalkar, former Maharashtra chief secretary, as members.

    What is evident in the flurry of meetings, from New Delhi to Nagpur, is the growing realisation that on November 26 night, all systems that could have prevented a 26/11 failed.


    Even on the morning of 26/11, a communication asking for activation of 10 SIM cards was picked up by the R&AW on the Bangladesh border. Intelligence agencies failed to decipher its significance. At 9.21 pm, the attack began

    IB chief Haldar and his R&AW counterpart Ashok Chaturvedi failed to act on the top-secret alert (see the scanned document below) sent to then Maharashtra DG P S Pasricha on November 20, 2007. Haldar wrote to Pasricha that reliable inputs indicated that the LeT was planning a major terrorist strike and the action might involve “fidayeen attack, stand-off firing and use of grenades”. Even though the exact target had not been disclosed, he added, the operation could involve taking hostages. Asking the DG to sensitise his officers, Haldar promised to revert “as soon as” more information was available. Even as Special Director, Multi-Agency Centre (MAC), Haldar had written to Pasricha on August 7, 2006, and given details of specific targets in Maharashtra.

    However, Haldar never reverted back to Pasricha, despite the promise, till four days after the Marriot Hotel bombing in Islamabad. On September 20, 2008, Joint Director (MAC) IB Ashok Prasad alerted the Maharashtra DG (the scanned document on top) that the LeT was planning an attack in Mumbai and identified Taj Mahal Palace Hotel, Vallabbhai Patel Stadium, Sea Rock or Taj Land's End Hotel, Mumbai Juhu airfield and JW Marriot Hotel as likely targets.

    The scene now shifted to Delhi and the US, through established intelligence channels, alerted R&AW Joint Secretary A K Dashmana in a November 18, 2008, meeting that an LeT ship was trying to infiltrate into Indian waters. It also gave latitudinal and longitudinal coordinates of the vessel. This input was passed on to the IB for dissemination to the respective agencies. Joint Director Prabhakar Alok forwarded the input to the Naval Headquarters and the Coast Guard for action.

    [b]While the Naval Headquarters never passed on the intelligence to its sword-arm, the Western Navy, the Coast Guard launched a search for the suspected LeT vessel on November 21 dawn. As the provided coordinates by the US Intelligence put the vessel 20-30 miles south of Karachi, the Coast Guard never found the ship. Its officers not only wrote a letter to IB Joint Director Alok but also called him up in a bid to get more intelligence. Alok promised to revert, but like his boss never did. [/b]

    Even on the morning of 26/11, a communication asking for activation of 10 SIM cards was picked up by the R&AW on the Bangladesh border. Intelligence agencies failed to decipher its significance. At 9.21 pm, the attack began, with Ajmal Kasab and Ismail Khan opening fire at the CST Terminus. The Mumbai Police top brass was at the time making their way to Oberoi Trident to attend a wedding.


    A price was paid for the division of authority between the Mumbai Police Commissioner, who was absent from the command centre, and the DG, who is in-charge of the state but not the city

    Almost around the same time, there was another high-level meeting on at another place in the city. The then Maharashtra Anti-Terrorism Squad Chief Hemant Karkare, DG Roy and the then state Home Minister R R Patil were discussing the sensitive Malegaon blast investigation. Around 9 pm, they called it a day. Karkare called up home to say he would be back in time for dinner, while Roy left to pick up his wife for the Trident wedding.

    While they were on their way to the hotel, Roy got a call from a friend at Masala Kraft restaurant in the Taj Palace Hotel saying that there was firing outside. The DG immediately alerted DCP (Zone I) Vishwas Nagre Patil to reach the spot and take control as it could be gang warfare. The friend again called up, and this time the DG could hear the continuous burst of fire on the phone. Roy decided to give up the plan to go to the wedding and returned to the headquarters. Here all top state officials except that of the Mumbai Police were watching the action on TV in his room, along with Home Minister Patil.

    Roy called up the Mumbai Police Commissioner’s control room, only to find that Joint Commissioner (Crime) Rakesh Maria handling the operations and Police Commissioner Hasan Gafoor were not there. By now, reports of firing were pouring in from CST Terminus, Cama Hospital, Taj Palace, Nariman House and Trident Hotel. With Gafoor parked inside his car outside the Trident, the command and control of Mumbai Police response had collapsed, with few ready to take orders from Maria and Roy not in charge of the city.

    The city and the country paid heavily for the division of authority between the Mumbai Police Commissioner and the DG on that day as the two for the past decade have had a separate police communication network, budget and operational control. Even the annual confidential report of the Mumbai Police Commissioner is written by State Additional Chief Secretary and not by the State DG.

    The decision to withdraw AK-47 assault rifles from the police inspectors, taken by Roy as Mumbai Police Commissioner three years ago, also proved disastrous. All that the Mumbai Police had in response to the LeT's artillery was assault fire and grenades of World War II vintage, .303 Lee Enfield rifles, .38 bore revolvers, 9 mm pistols and lathis.

    Only Additional Commissioner Ashok Kamte had got an AK-47 issued from police armoury that day. When he came face to face with the terrorists along with encounter specialist Vijay Salaskar and Karkare, he fired twice at Kasab but missed narrowly. Not wearing the state-of-the-art bullet-proof headgear he had got from Kosovo, he was shot dead along with his two colleagues. It was around midnight that Maria and Roy realised the situation had got out of control. Maharashtra Chief Secretary Johny Joseph was requested to seek commandos and the NSG for help.

    Given the cost of the breakdown of coordination that day, the state Government is now mulling putting the Mumbai Police Commissioner under the direct control of the state DG. This was given in-principle clearance at the meeting in Nagpur last week, but will become operational only after the three-member inquiry committee has submitted its report.

    So, on 26/11, barring constable Tukaram Omble, who took Kasab’s five bullets in his chest to arrest him, and a handful of officers, the Mumbai Police was found woefully wanting. This set the stage for the Army, Naval Commandos (MARCOS) and the NSG to enter the theatre of operations.


    [b]Marcos first refused to enter the hotels without state authorisation, then claimed to have killed two terrorists inside Taj within hours of starting operations. That information was totally false [/b]

    [b]The first to be called for commando help was Mumbai Sub-Area Commander Major General R K Hooda, who in turn informed the Maharashtra Government that he did not have any Army commandos with him. So what the public saw in the early hours were only Army footsoldiers on peripheral duties and not crack troops. [/b] [i]This really needs comment. The reporter is talking through his hat. What the hell is an army "foot soldier'? Every armyman is an elite fighting man. Rubbish like this is amazing.[/i]

    [b]On November 26 midnight, Joseph called up Western Naval Commander J S Bedi for marine commandos as well as NSG Director J K Dutt in Delhi. It took another two hours for MARCOS to finally arrive. Although the Navy denies it, MARCOS refused to enter the Taj or Trident without written authorisation from the state Government.[/b] After the matter was sorted, two columns (seven each) of MARCOS entered the Taj and the Trident complexes. With the NSG team headed by a Brigadier still on its way, having had to arrange an IL-76 aircraft from Chandigarh to fly them and then Union Home Minister Shivraj Patil, the MARCOS made it officially known that they had killed two terrorists at the Taj complex between 4-4.30 am.

    [b]This information was totally false and it is still not clear whether the MARCOS engaged the enemy directly on that day[/b]. The NSG landed at 4.20 am on November 27 and took over the operation at 9 am as the MARCOS refused to function under the NSG Brigadier. In fact Army and Navy officers further complicated matters by going live on TV channels while the fire-fight was on. Southern Army Commander Noble Thamburaj talked about a dozen terrorists being present in the Taj to the media even though he had no direct knowledge of the operations. General Hooda, the Sub-Area Commander, played to the gallery while the MARCOS projected itself as Rambo.

    Neither did NSA Narayanan, who was out at a party that fateful day, nor the then chief minister took matters in their control. Shivraj Patil was in Mumbai only for a few hours during which he announced that terrorists had run away. A month after the Mumbai massacre, during which IB operational chief D K Sinha and R&AW Joint Secretary J S Khanna were in constant touch, a number of questions remain unanswered:

    • Identity of the local contacts of the terrorists who helped the LeT identify the targets, including Nariman House? Past three year records of all the Taj and Trident Hotel employees have revealed nothing.

    • Is there an al-Qaeda link to the Lashkar attack as for the first time Jews were slaughtered?

    • Identity and location of the controller talking to the two Taj Palace terrorists? The controller virtually gave away his location when the terrorist asked him, “Wahan kitne baaje hain?” The VOIP call was traced to West Virginia and then lost.

    • Were there 15 terrorists in total with five following up in another boat? The hunt is still on. The track back device in the used GPS was set for K T Bandar near Karachi.

    • Who is the owner of ship Al Hussaini? [/quote]

    This article is full of so much rubbish that it is very obviously a plant by someone who has taken advantage of a naive and rather stupid reporter, or a paid off reporter. General Hooda is accused of behaving "like a rambo". He was the one voice of reason, on a day when DGP AN Roy was yapping non stop nonsense on the television. The MARCOS are accused of not engaging the terrorists. I wonder how some of their number were injured then? The army is accused of sending "Foot soldiers" and not "Crack troops". What is this rubbish?

    The navy is accused of not entering the complex until given authority. In response, I will post Mr. Johny Joseph, Chief Secretary Maharashtra's letter, detailing what he has to say about some such accusations, and I quote:

    [quote]"When the Police Commissioner informed that it was an attack by groups of terrorists, firing with sophisticated weapons and bomb attacks and that, it was necessary to get the services of Army and other Commandos to rescue the trapped people from various places,[b] I immediately got in touch, (between 10.30 and 11.00 p.m.) with Maj.General Hooda of the Army and Admiral Cheema of Navy stationed in Mumbai who responded immediately and without any hesitation despatched Army Columns and Naval Commandos to the spots indicated by us.[/b] Simultaneously I contacted the Union Cabinet Secretary at Delhi who immediately authorised despatch of 200 National Security Guard Commandos."[/quote]

    Who is this Shishir Gupta, and who the devil is his editor? Surely the tripe in this article is actionable for libel and slander! Ive never heard such rot.

  14. 14


    Chiriya boli kut-kut-kut
    Mujhe de do , do biskoot
    bhookh lagi hai khaaoongi
    kha kar phir so jaaoongi

    dudh malai rakhhi hai
    par us mein to makhhi hai
    kaise khaaoon kaise khaaoon

    Chalo bhookhi hi so jaaoon

    I am a big engine , puf, puf, puf
    Waiting to set off, chuff, chuff, chuff,

    Blow my whistle, tooth, tooth, tooth
    A station bell is ringing now, ding-dong, ding-dong.

  15. 16


    Hi Shiv,
    Thks for your observations. But you forgot to mention the basic fact that an Indian loses his / her basic fundamental human rights under the Constitution of India on joining the Defence Forces, in that, they cannot form associations / unions to represent their point of view. There is no system / procedure where the defence personnel can represent as a group. It is, therefore, incumbent on the nation through the govt to ensure that the defence personnel get their due ” IZZAT” which is measured in terms of money in India. Media can play a vital role in this.

  16. 17


    Our dear friend Pragmatic from is once again at what he does best….Trying to castigate and break the last Bastion of Integrity left in our country. Read the article “Holding the defence services accountable” for 26/11 fiasco and comment for yourself….that is only …if Prags does not edit unfavourable opinions.

  17. 18


    Indeed the past year was bad, not just for the armed forces, but for everyone, professionally, personally, private sector etc.

    More so for the private sector, owing to recession, meltdown etc, so many people lost jobs, atleast the armed forces and government employees don’t have to bother about where salary will come from, but look at the private employees.

    People committing suicides, no jobs, no salary.

    its worse for them and these faujis keep fighting for more money.

    2008 was bad for me , indeed. Personally and professionally it was really bad for me. Lets see if 2009 has hopes. Amen!

  18. 19


    well said shiv, keep up the good work, god bless.

  19. 20



    Irrespective of your misplaced spirit..the system is dissolving and not evolving..

    There was a system at the time of independence..

    Then it was badly changed in favor of Independant Babu as if Babus only got Independence and Armed Forces reamined Colonial. So Babus were made sureme and Armed Forces enslaved…

    That process of enslaving continued and is continueing….

    So you call it evolution????

    What evolution ?. Are the Armed forces personnel second class citizens in India or mere gate keeprs of IAS Babus as many of them described Armed Forces.

    The evolution is that thse Babus have evolved into extortinists, fund raisers, Contract looters, and bathroom keeprs of Politicians. Their nexus with corrupt politicians and Police is complete. That has gone into their head and The Clarks thinks he is king.

    That is dessolution of system and not evolution….your pontification is in the air…

  20. 21



    1857 was first war of Independence and not Mutiny….. Clear your facts…and perceptions..

  21. 22


    Sishir Ghuptu and Sekhar Duppatta like MR SWAMY OF OUTLOOK appears to have undertaken fully apaid jobs of IPS and IAS. They themselves having not made it there( I can even quote their number of attempts and years) but are playing as cadremen from outside to satisfy failed desire. Who does not know how much of slush funds IPS have at their disposal to buy out lowly Guptas…

    Have No sense of fair play. Who the hell does not know that defence forces do need authorisation. Only a first class megistrate can reaquision their help under law, not a Secretary or DGP or or an IPS clot. And that when armed Forces are requisition No clot is the boss around to control the situation but only the Forces commander…Change laws but do not ask Forces do illegal things.

    If the Countries self proclaiming elites, reporters and editors do not know this much , they have no right to undertake paid barking…

    Poor haunking it is…

  22. 23


    Bad years are desirable once in a while!

    It shakes the organization and its people out of complacency.

  23. 24




  24. 25



    Congrats! on a well written piece. Unlike other so called ‘military specialists’ you have at least recognised fauji are human too. Thanks and Good Luck for your future writings.

  25. 26


    People are applauding Shiv as if he has written something extraordinary or new.

    He doesn’t know what’s a Command or other formations, just tows the line of the armed forces, as thats the policy of Aroon Purie, to keep the faujis happy, so that no rejoinders come (as TV Today is stuck in a case because of Shiv’s incorrect reporting).

    So this is Shiv Aroor’s reporting. He goes to jantar Mantar these days to cover protests, something he never did in Express. Is this what he has been reduced to. Shiv if you want to show solidarity then expose the black sheep in the government who are opposing the pay commission etc.

    Do you have the guts or the sources ?

  26. 27

    Lt Col VK Sharma

    I am glad that the LeT finally got its act together to kill the so called elite of this country in Mumbai,(at least some of them) having missed out the manmohans and sonias at the parliament. I now feel sorry for having needlessly and misguidedly killed LeT sods for the last 10 years and lost many good officers and men. But then we were living in a fools paradise that this pay commission rudely awoke me from. If the babu-neta want gladiators instead of soldiers, so be it. They are ready to pay good money for my blood but my living flesh is not good enough for parity, is it?
    Well, I swear, for what its worth, in memory of all my comrades, never to kill or contribute to kill another militant again.
    I wish they carry out another professional attack but spare the poor. It will truly gladden my heart if they can do so and kill only the babus and the netas.
    Also, the NSG CO ought to be sacked for losing an officer and an NCO.

  27. 28


    Dear Friends,

    The issue of MPF and CPO need to be understood clearly. We have only two PMF in The country, that is Assam Rifles and The Coast Guard. When we say Par Military Force what is claerly implied is that the force is rolled, designed and organised to carry out Military Functions and is under operational command of the Military. Therefore, it has elements of military command and control integral to it. Pak has many PMF organisation like the erstwhile NLI which has been converted into regulars now. Their rangers are also commanded and controlled by the Army. Hence when ever one talks of the Parity between Armed Forces and PMF like AR or Coast Guard it is tolerable.

    CPO in our country are a different and vastly dissimilar organizations having purely police roles. They are armed, equipped and structured to carry out “Danda Mar” colonial or Guarding Job, barely capable of protection of the VPs and VAs, that too is doubtful. Their training, attitudes and mindsets are not engaged towards military task except for the BSF that too very limited. One can not expect CISF or CRPF or RPF, the loudest claimer of Military status amongst them, to be of any military value. Hence, calling them as CPMF is not only a joke but also reflective of the desire of their MHA and IPS bosses to gain Military status. All CPO cadre of officers used to be class B status till recently. The cadre is auxiliary cadre to be commanded at higher level by the IPS. This is an entirely IPS domain forces propped up to claim equivalence to Army.

    It is very unfortunate that in their blind and unchecked desire to dominate affairs, the IAS and IPS have tried to bring the status of Army to be considered at Par with auxillary CPO. Earlier at all pay Commissions, Defence officers equivalence was considered with IPS but this pay commission deliberately pushed down Defence to the equivalence of the CPOs as Shushma Nath’s happened to be an IPS officer. Not only that, CPO officers were deliberately brought to demand equivalence and Parity with Armed Forces. If any thing CPO officers shouls have demanded Parity and opportunities equivalent to IPS. Can any one ask my CPO friends why they are asking equivallance with a different Cadre and organization. First get similar opportunities within your organization and equate yourselves with IPS. Equating with Army is nothing but IPS Conspiracy added and helped by MOD zealots and KM Chandrasekhar.

    Friends like BP Sing and others talked of “Eqility of Job and Pay”. Whereas equility of Job is just their dream and imaginary why do not they insist on equity of Pay perks and promotions with IPS. Insisted on equality of Pay with Navy AirForce and Army simply is stupidy and nothing but insired consiracy. They do not see their equations with “security Gurds” when it comes to equal Jobs but spit towards the sky which is domain of Armed Forces. This was deliberately done to push down the Equivallance status of Armed forces officers by the IAS and IPS, particularly the duo of Ms Naths, one IAS and one IPS and all other highest Babus.

    That imples Armed Forces virtually have been pushed down. IPS controlling investigative agencies like CID, Crime, IB, RAW etc have been co-opted by the IAS as second fiddle. They control vote rigging, spying on opponents, booking political opponents on false pretexts and policing. Therefore they are useful to the Politicians and the IAS. That is why grudgingly the status of second fiddle to them.

    However, psychologically and apparently, the IPS always vied and copied the Army in uniform, ranks and status. So the story of all successive Pay Commissions is of IAS and IPS joining hands in pushing the Armed Forces down and down. The story of DIG or IG or DG gaining tin pot general status is nothing but the consequences of the combined assault on Armed Forces buy greedy, mentally insecure and power hungry IAS and IPS. They just can not stand the darling of the masses and country – the Armed Forces.

    So much so that they have managed to push Defence Forces to the status of CPO, their Auxiliary Cadre. In the form of NSG, the IPS even have made Army Officers as their auxiliary Cadre. That is what their overall aim is.

    How can Army Chief stand all this. It is simply unacceptable and illogical. National interest is not the sole prerogative of COAS. IPS have not moved on any appointments keeping national interests subordinate to their personal interest. That is a disgrace for Army officers. It is believed he has written a letter to MoD but that is not enough. No new officer should be posted to NSG unless this damage is rectified. Jointness of Command and interests is at the level of Ministry (secretary security) and not at functional levels.

    This needs immediate attention or the COAS will be replaced soon by an IPS. They are inching on to that. This is the mental make up and character of the so called highest examination qualified elites of India.

    Save yourselves from these durbar cronies so save India. That is the highest military responsibility and national interest

    Jai Hind

  28. 29


    Want to know why its been a bad year, and why theyll only get worse? … corruption


    For babus, shoplifting worse than corruption

    Aloke Tikku , Hindustan Times
    Email Author
    New Delhi, December 28, 2008
    First Published: 00:45 IST(28/12/2008)

    What is the yardstick for assessing the gravity of misdemeanours committed by bureaucrats? The Union Public Service Commission (UPSC) has made recommendations in individual cases, but the government hasn’t always followed its advice.

    For instance, according to a report tabled in Parliament last week, a woman Indian Administrative Service (IAS) officer was retired for shoplifting at London department store Marks & Spencer a decade ago. But other officers accused of corrupt practices have got away with milder punishments.

    The Uttar Pradesh cadre officer — part of an official delegation to Britain — was caught stealing two cashmere jumpers and a jacket. On the advice of a lawyer arranged by the high commission, she pleaded guilty and paid a fine of £150 (about Rs 11,000, as per current rates) imposed by the Magistrate Court of Marlborough Street.

    The inquiry she faced back home exonerated her, but the red-faced government decided to make an example out of her.

    While the UPSC agreed her conduct was unbecoming of an IAS officer, it said compulsory retirement was too harsh a punishment. It recommended that her salary be reduced in two stages over two years.

    The government, however, told Parliament last week that the misconduct made her retention “untenable and the penalty advised by the UPSC did not meet the ends of justice”.

    “Compulsory retirement seems too severe for a silly act like shoplifting,” said a senior government official, “especially when people who rob the exchequer go scot-free”.

    Like this senior diplomat posted as head of the chancery in Riyadh who reemployed his India-based domestic help but misreported facts by claiming $5,086 (Rs 2.5 lakh, as per today’s rates) as the help’s salary from the government.

    The UPSC recommended compulsory retirement “at the very least” plus recovery of $5,086. The government, however, declined to accept the advice since the officer’s disciplinary authority only initiated proceedings for a minor penalty.

    And then there was this IAS officer in West Bengal, who was let off with a “notional penalty of 5 per cent cut in pension” after an inquiry found he “failed to maintain absolute integrity”, acquiring assets worth Rs 7 lakh in excess of his known income.

    (Officers’ names withheld by UPSC in all cases)

    Contrast the highly critical coverage of the armed forces recently, with the benevolent, almost indulgent tone of this article. So an IAS officer is caught trying to steal some bum and tum tights from Marks and Spencers… should we really go so far as to fire her, this paper asks. Isnt it unfair, when an IFS officer can steal 5800$ from the govt as salary for a servant?

    And when we have quotations from potenteates suggesting that she should be let off, because shop-lifting is a "silly act", we see exactly how low standards have fallen in our civil services, and the reason for many of the ills in our governance setup today.

    Maybe we shouldnt retire her. Maybe we should investigate what else she has stolen during her illustrious career.

    At least other countries magistrates have the sense to convict thieves, even though in our country the stores owners would have just considered it a hafta.

  29. 30


    May go through this with a critical mind but take home points on deterrance against terrorism:


    Intelligence man Swamy has turned Strategician but when there were hundreds of terrorists in The Rear of Punch in surankot, he demafed the Army for undertaking operations SARPVINASH there lest some of the Intelligence (IB / RAW) bosses arse is fired up…

    Strange standards some jouranists have like Sekhar Duppatta…

  30. 31


    Dear Mr Aroor:
    The General officers who have been circulating among the crowd and possibly holding the hands of those who are on fast unto death, what are THEY doing?
    As former leaders of men, WHY HAVEN’T THEY THOUGHT IT FITTING IN THE INTERESTS OF ALL THAT THEY SHOULD BE LEADING BY EXAMPLE? Why are they not sitting along with the retired PBOR and FASTING UNTO DEATH?
    If they expect that Indian Govt to retract its stand merely because some Ex-PBOR are about to commit suicide, they have another think coming.

  31. 32


    @ anony 2:13 PM
    dear friend, i agree with u that these ias and ips lobbies are out to ruin armed forces. they have over a period of time elevated their status. but i feel its natural for any organisation/cadre/dept to make attempts for their growth and elevation of status. i feel they are justified in their efforts in improving their lifestyles. pl do not get me wrong, i am with u. what i want to indicate is, our senior lot has been sleeping. why did they not open up earlier. u and me both know… they are getting everything (perks and previleges) and they are not affected… thats why they did not do anything in past…this time lt gens were directly affected thats why so much of hue and cry is being made by chiefs…sorry only chief of naval staff…coas and cas still seem to be spunkless… i have my doubts once lt gen go into hag+ bracket, they may still chose to keep quiet… i have full doubts…

  32. 33


    there should be at least 2 years mandatory military service for all ias and ips.

  33. 34

    Navin Srivastava

    2008 A Bad Year has not been so bad for the enemy within us. This enemy is far better protected, better armed – corruption. This enemy stares and dares us brazenly saying destroy me if you can. In my heart of hearts I know like millions of fellow Indians that this is one enmey that needs more than NSG commandos, or even the entire military might of the nation to eliminate,because most of the time, the foe is faceless. It is exactly this corrosive, all pervading corruption that has done the Armed Forces in. So what chance do a bunch of hunger strikers have against a phantom because they are trained to fight and external enemy. How can they fight their own mother?

  34. 35


    i,am a central govt employee, why do army people cry about less pay, no parrity e.t.c. I f they feel that they deserve more, let them leave and earn it outside, that is if they feel they are capable.

  35. 36


    Hmm, notice that the notification has not come out. I am sure that the chiefs are seeing this through and making sure that no dud notification comes out of all this.

    Agree fully that the Army chief should stop posting officers to mixed orgs. You are lowering the status of Army officers by accepting the unequal so called parity established by the IPS, at its face value.

    If you keep posting Brigadiers with 30 years service under IGPs with 16 years service, you will get what you deserve. Service officers should refuse such postings immediately.

    The army chief should be raising the concerns of his men at the appropriate levels, instead of waiting it out hoping that he will get a governership of some crummy state in 2 years, like the last illustrious chief did.


    And the following parity to be demanded:

    1. Lt-> JTS+Edge
    Maj Gen->HAG+ +EDGE

  36. 37


    Dear anonymous@941am ,we would leave if we could and then you guys will be doing the crying, when the Pakis with their NFWP cousind will come and rape and murder your sisters and daughters and wives. we will still be able to defend ourselves, but you guys are going to just sit on your files and petition.

  37. 38


    Shiv has become famous in the services b’cos of pay commission…he’s become thier hero…even if he cant do anything for them (which is true), atleast he’ll make some contacts and sources!!

    Good strategy Shiv (are you a Pakistani by any chance. With a stubble you look like a Muslim)

  38. 39


    Haha lots of grumpy uncivil servants out here, resenting the fact that they havent silenced all the media.

  39. 40


    Amusing to read some ill-advised and researched opinion by Shishir Gupta but then that is what sells papers and earns TRPs.

    Corrupt politicians, bureaucrats and policemen are passe – the flavour of the season is painting the Armed Forces with a tainted brush in the hope something sticks.

    But emotions are not the requirement of the day. The Armed forces – serving and Veterans – need some inspired leadership that will channelise the angst and the energy to achieving objectives.

    Maybe the retired Lt Gens should also undertake fasts (and miss their daily chhotas) for a few days.

  40. 41


    Am a civilian (for a change here). I am ”also” patriotic – contribute to nation economically. Am a little disappointed by the vitriol being poured here by the Armed forces personnel.
    I have friends in AFs.. very dear friends from school.. I could never imagine them talking about 1857 repeats and as Lt Col VK Sharma said – be glad about killing of elite in the country…

    No I believe them to be better men.. And they are..

    Sharma sir.. what is elite? I go to 5 stars all the time. I am not an elite. My father is was a govt servant (retired). Finished his engineering through loan. I did my MBA through loan. If I have an earning capacity, it is through my hard work and enterprise.
    I wont have people like you branding me elite just because I happen go to some hotels. I know where I come from , my roots are firmly grounded in middle class India. Last thing I want is some dissatisfied armymen telling me what I am and what I am supposed to do and how I am so dispensable.
    I have a lot of respect for Armed forces. Please dont make me lose it.
    This is India, not Pakistan…. Period. Behave and talk like it

    Was in Rajasthan for last two weeks.. realized that rajput bravery is more of a myth, they sold out to Mughals first and brits later. That is why they still retain their palaces and splendor!!. Have no respect for them any more..
    Message: Ethics over material things… It matters. You have to earn respect, cant demand it..


  41. 42


    With this kind of maltreatment and insult of the defence forces I do not give this stupid nation of Baboos more than 20 years. East will be eaten away by Bangadesh and the Talibans will be at India Gate and inside the Indian Parliament. The Baboos will be not effected. They will become servants of the Taliban our masses will enjoy the rape and plunder which they have been missing since emergence of the Indian Army. The Indian genes will be further forcibly enriched and we will proudly record in our history that one more aggressor in Indian history has been ‘assimilate’ in our culture. And it wil go on. Indian Army which is an abration in this gutter called Indian society will vanish without a trace. Jai Hind

  42. 43


    If you find Faujis talking of repeat of 1857 dont give them sermons but use your brain and go into the reasons. Ask your AF friends or better still join the Army better still infantry and have some fun. If you have a son motivate him to join Infantry and shed his blood for the nation. But you would not do that . He will follow your path as you followed your fathers safe path and now you give sermons to the Foujis asking them tho behave and what not.And thanks a lot for telling the faujis that this is India and not Pakistan. We did not know it. And if things go on like this and friend like you wiht MBA degrees keep giving us Bhashan it will indeed be pakistan with the Taliban at the India gate and inside the Parliament.

  43. 44


    Please see the coverage of the operations being carried out by the army in Poonch- Mendhar. While it is the Army troops that are fighting and getting killed there, the media keeps flashing a police officer who is a spectator at the road head. This footage can now be shown to mean that the police too does the same job as the army and in the next pay commission the fauj can be brought down a notch further.


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